Taking her band's name from a typically wordy XTC song title, Aiha Higurashi started her career with Seagull Screaming Kiss Her Kiss Her, a punk band with pop leanings (or a pop band with punk leanings, take your pick.) But rather than emphasizing the more accessible end of her chosen territory, her band dove headfirst into the jagged, uncommercial end of punk and New Wave. Interesting, but the surprise was how successful they were: where most artists of that particular experimental bent are usually resigned to cult status, SSKHKH made a serious impact, signing with mega indie Trattoria/Polystar, touring with such luminaries as Modest Mouse and racking up fans like Sonic Youth and Beck.

After her band's dissolution in 2001, Higurashi went solo, and recently formed Aiha Higurashi And Loves! (the exclamation point is part of the name,) a group that returns to the juxtaposition of the sweet and the jagged that has marked her career for over fifteen years. Her music confronts sex, depression, and motherhood with a directness that is extremely unusual in Japanese society in general, let alone the rock/pop scene she inhabits.

In a small cafe near her home in Tokyo, she sat down with Jrawk to discuss No Wave, the conflict between pop and punk, and questionable hair styles.

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JR: How did Seagull Screaming Kiss Her Kiss Her start? Was it when you were in New York?

AH: Before that, I tried to get a unit...a group together called Seagull Screaming Kiss Her Kiss Her, but with another girl...not Nao (Koyama, SSKHKH bassist.) Just two girls, singing more like pop, cute rock. Then I got kind of sick of it! (laughs) I realized it wasn't in my character. I talked about it with my partner, and she wanted to study abroad, in Germany. She was into languages, and so was I. She said that, and I thought "yeah, let's do that!" It was a good chance for me to learn different languages, and other cultures' arts and music, anything. I asked my parents. I was 19 at the time, we decided that London would be safer than the United States! (laughs) They said OK, so long as it was London, so I went there first. I stayed for six months, but I didn't go to school much! (laughs) I DID go to clubs, almost every night...I made a lot of friends, went to shows. Madchester was going on, that was a good time for me.

I saw some major bands, like Dinosaur Jr., grunge bands, other bands like Lush. When my visa expired, I decided to go to New York. I had studied English on my own, I got my TOEFL certification in Japan, then applied for school in New York. My school was a little different...it was connected to NYU, so I could study there.

JR: Connected...it wasn't actually NYU?

AH: No, I was a prep student. I had time...I went to see a lot of movies, I was into film. I was always going to see movies, so much so that the employees starting giving me tea whenever they saw me! (laughs) I would be there almost every day, I'd spend hours there. There were a lot of art films, gay and lesbian films, older 40s and 50s Hollywood films, stuff like that. They'd have live shows there sometimes.

Give Them Back To Me (1996)

JR: Speaking of which, what kind of shows did you see? You were in New York when bands like Sonic Youth were at their height.

AH: I actually first met Sonic Youth and Jad Fair in Tokyo! They played (Shimokitazawa club) The Shelter. I didn't have a ticket, it was sold out, so I waited until the show finished. As people left the venue, I walked in. No one thought to stop me! (laughs) I got to meet Jad, Kim Gordon, Steve Shelley. Kim thought my braces were cute! She remembered me and got me into the show the next day. So when I moved to New York, I already knew them. My apartment there was close to their office.

JR: The connection makes sense, because when I listen to early SSKHKH, I hear a lot of No Wave influence.

AH: Wow...that's fantastic!

JR: Even now, with Loves, I can hear some influence from people like James Chance.

AH: I do love James Chance...that's the main reason I hired a saxophone player. I'd play it myself if I could! I like the "No New York" stuff more than British punk rock...I don't really know the British punk stuff.

JR: OK, to clarify the time line...when did SSKHKH happen in all this?

AH: I came back to Japan after about a year and a half in New York, I recorded, played some live shows, then went back for another six months.

JR: So who did you see in New York?

AH: Of course, Sonic Youth, John Zorn, Jad Fair, Ween, Mo Tucker, Slant 6...I don't remember! (laughs) Oh yes, and Sleepyhead, I became friends with them, they were an opening act for Sonic Youth. I didn't see so much New York punk.

JR: Listening to the first album, it's obvious you spent time in New York. There's a lot of sonic experimentation, lo-fi, things that weren't typical of Japanese music at the time...

AH:..yeah, I was too early! (laughs)

JR: There's also a strong element of frank sexuality, which is very unusual.

AH: (Nods) As an Asian female, yes.

JR: Was that a conscious decision?

AH: Yeah. I'm not trying to attract too much attention, but I just want to...feel myself as a sexy girl, sexy woman...I believe in that, that's a good thing.

JR: Has that caused any issues In Japan? With record labels, maybe...

AH: No one knows English! (laughs)

JR: It really is striking, though. For example, "No Bed Of Roses," ends with the line "I'm very busy fucking right now."

It's Brand New (1997)

AH: I wanted to stress that women have power, and strength, that energy. Maybe even more than men, so...why not? (laughs)

JR: That's always been in your music, but when "17" came out, there was an added dimension. I don't know anything about your personal history at the time, but there's something about that album that seems...hurt. The expression on your face on the cover is hurt and tired.

AH: I WAS tired! (laughs) I was tired of touring around the US, booking shows, being with the band all the time, taking care of people. I was always caught between the other members...we were tight, but it was stressful.

JR: So there was conflict between (bassist) Nao and (drummer) Takape?

AH: I had to calm them down. I was like their mother! (laughs)

JR: The music was stripped down considerably.

AH: Before "17," there was "It's Brand New," and I had to think about all the effects, and new sounds. I had to do everything by myself, I was the producer, I played, I had to decide everything. It was a very tough time, and using all those effects...it sounded great, it's good but I wasn't satisfied with my production, or how I used the effects. I wanted to simplify and throw away everything that we didn't need. (from "It's Brand New:" "School Lunch," a live version of "A Shotgun And Me")

JR: The combination of that cover ("17") and the stripped down material, it seems you're tired of everything. The speech in the beginning of "Coma" sounds almost apathetic. It's a bit like the first Syd Barrett album...

17 (1998)

AH: Syd Barrett? (laughs) That's the second time someone's said that to me!

JR: It's as if it hurt you to make the record. It also reminds me of other albums that were made when the artists were in pain, like Big Star's Third.

AH: I LOVE Big Star, I love that! For the jacket...we had a different jacket originally. It was so dark...I had spent a lot of time with the designer, we had worked together before, so I trusted him, but his idea for "17" didn't fit the album. I found another artist...it was a lot of effort, I was literally tired!

(Pauses, thinks.) My sickness...I'm manic-depressive. Since I was...the symptoms started before I went to New York. By "17," I was sicker than ever.

JR: "Don't Cry My Bunny" sounds exactly like manic depression.

AH: (Nods) I try to simplify myself and open the window of my mind, to let people know me. I'm alive, I'm hurt, but I'm OK! (laughs) (from the album: "Coma," "Double Life," a live version of "Down To Mexico")

JR: After "17," you had your daughter, and when "No! No! No!" came out...

No! No! No! (2000)

AH: "No! No! No!" was sicker!

JR: Really?

AH: After birth, I had post-natal depression, pretty heavy. I was grabbing, clinging to my job as a musician. I had to cling to music to live. I was drinking vodka while I was recording, to keep myself going. The album sounds happy because I wanted to be happier.

JR: There's a lot of conflict. "Motor Psycho" is all about conflict, but at the same time, you had songs about your daughter, which balanced things out.

AH: (Thinks) At the time, I was writing so many dark songs, so I wrote some bright songs as well. I'm basically an optimistic person.

JR: To change the subject...what was with the hairstyles on the cover?

AH: (Laughs) They're like old Japanese hard core permed hairstyles! I asked the designer to make a Roxy Music-like cover. It was miserable! (laughs) Something not real, something unreal. That was the point, but...(laughs) (from the album: "No Star," "No Telephone")

JR: "Future Or No Future" had a really unreal, almost cute cover.

Future Or No Future (2001)

AH: That was my idea. I hired a photographer, asked my manager to bring the bed. I was healthy at that time, I was stable. I felt like being pop. (from the album: "Evolution")

JR: Speaking of pop, that album was more traditional in terms of songs. Sometimes, your work is a bit like early Wire, in that you'll have quick, short tracks next to fuller, more typically pop songs, but like you said, "Future Or No Future" was more pop. Was that intentional?

AH: "No! No! No!" was intentional, I wanted to make a punk rock album...but for "Future Or No Future," I just wanted to try a more colorful album. Simple, colorful, maybe, I don't know, more...memorable? Catchy.

I was always conflicted between punk and pop songs. Always fighting, pop is too commercial..."punk is good, but pop is good, but punk..." Still, I'm very conflicted.

JR: "Future Or No Future" was the last album. Why split up?

AH: We had been together for 10 years, we'd been living close to each other, we'd tour the US, and we'd even sleep in the same bedroom for a month at a time. It was fun, I'll never forget it...

But. Nao and Takape were always fighting. Nao asked me to fire Takape...Seagull was getting bigger, we were touring with people like Cornelius and Modest Mouse. He was getting kind of...

JR: ...he thought he was a rock star.

Born Beautiful (2004)

AH: Yeah. I thought so, although I could have been wrong. Nao and I would be in the studio, he was always late and he didn't practice much. Because of that, I could ask him to go. I don't want to blame Nao...but Takape was kind of scared of me, but not Nao. So he would say things to her, and then she'd tell me about it...never ending! (laughs) Finally I discussed it with my manager, but I decided to do it myself. I had to find someone else.

My manager (Yasunobu Arakawa) was a professional drummer! I asked him, but he refused. He wanted to watch! (laughs) But finally I talked him into it. So for half of "No! No! No!" and all of "Future Or No Future," we had Yasu.

Nao and I are really tight. We spent all our time together, just two girls...I'm not like that, but Nao maybe...she wanted to hang out more, but I may have been selfish.

JR: She's more of a social animal.

AH: (Nods) I was more alone. I like it...I need it. But I understand Nao's feelings. And now 10 years later, I'm good friends with Takape. He's in a new band, too (Kukunakke.)

JR: After the breakup...how did it happen that (then former Judy and Mary vocalist) Yuki recorded "The End Of Shite?"

AH: Before I signed with Sony, Yuki called. Yuki was a fan, and she was looking for a producer, songwriter, and musician...I could be all of those! I told her I had five songs that I had done for my solo project, so I could play them for her. She liked all five. She wanted me to produce, so I did it...I did all three: producer, songwriter, performer.

Platonic (2005)

JR: Your music was getting more positive...your solo debut ("Born Beautiful") was pretty positive.

AH: I recorded (first single) "New Life" in New York with Timo Ellis (Cibo Matto, Sean Lennon.) It was fun, after that we recorded the rest of "Born Beautiful." But I had to find members...I was solo. Completely alone! (laughs) I would bring my manager with me to live houses, and we saw this band Downey. They were really tight, they really impressed me. After the show, I asked them to join up. They got so excited, they were fans. I felt bad, because I couldn't ask the vocalist! (laughs) I had to ask everyone except the vocalist. Sorry...but we became almost like a band. (from the album: "New Life," "Fantasy,")

After SSKHKH, I moved to Sony. I got a good, long contract, but it tied me up. It was very restrictive, even the photos...it was stressful.

JR: It seems that "Born Beautiful" was happier, but your next album, "Platonic," was darker.

AH: Really? That's a different reaction. Everybody tells me "Born Beautiful" was darker, and "Platonic" was more pop. But I agree with you...because I hate "Platonic!" Well, maybe not hate, but I'm dissatisfied with it. Not every song, but several songs...

I like the songs with Keigo Oyamada (aka Cornelius,) and Nakako (ex-Supercar,) Sunahara (ex-Denki Groove), Miho (Hattori, ex-Cibo Matto) and Zak (recording engineer / producer,) but I don't really like other songs. (from the album: "Yumemitai," "Platonic," "Silly Girl" )

 JR: You were solo, but went back to being in a band with Aiha Higurashi And Loves!.

AH: After "Platonic," I was tired of being solo. I'd have to gather new members all the time. It was a good chance to keep things fresh, but...it's easier to be in a band, I had been in a band for so long! (from the band's debut "Lucky Me:" "Hide And Seek")

JR: Another thing you returned to was the conflict between the simpler, tougher stuff pop songs. "Sky" reminds me of early new wave, like A Certain Ratio and The Pop Group.

AH: Yeah, I came back to the basics. I realized I liked the "No New York" stuff, New Wave, because I had been through it.

JR: That was also the end of the contract with Sony. The new album, "Now Is The Time," is on your own label. (from the album: "Accidentally")

Lucky Me (2007)

AH: Totally my own label. I have to do everything! I'm not used to that. I'm also recording solo material, and next I'm going to be on new major label. The head of the new label used to work for (old SSKHKH label) Trattoria / Polystar. He remembered me, of course, I think he was waiting for me to ask to go back. I am lucky.

JR: A change of subject...what bands stick out in your mind as influences? We've mentioned James Chance, Sonic Youth...

AH: I like some acoustic stuff as well...Elliot Smith. I'm also really liking a French singer named Yelle. There's Joy Division, Patti Smith, Lou Reed, The Velvets...so many...but no Japanese bands.

JR: That was my next question. I've noticed that Japanese musicians don't seem to have strong sense of history with music from their own country.

AH: I like bands like Guitar Wolf, Shonen Knife...I never intended to ignore Japanese music, but there just weren't any bands that were influences.

Now Is The Time! (2008)

JR: Does it bother you that there's so little Japanese influence in Japanese rock?

AH: One thing I can't believe is that we're still...still looking to America, or England. Still! So many bands here don't have their own music, and it's sad. I'm proud of myself because I think I created my own style, but so many bands here...maybe there are some I don't know. In the 70s, I could maybe understand it...rock was still pretty new. But in 2009? Still?

But...I like a new Japanese band called Far France. Their music is so strong, and strange, it really shows guts. When they play, they have so much energy, but it's not just energy. I was surprised when I was told they were 21. I thought they were 30 or something! They sounded more mature. They have a lot of Japanese influence.

JR: Is there anything you'd like to add?

AH: As a Japanese artist, I played around the world, the US, etc. But as a Japanese musician, I want to play in Japan, and I want people to know that Japanese musicians are cool, and they should be proud!